So Why DIDN'T Saddam . . . ?

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Patrick M
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Postby Patrick M » Wed Apr 30, 2003 7:22 pm

Ron wrote:I read it in the April 30 issue of the International Herald Tribune--which means the New York Times--in an editorial by Times staffer Paul Krugman entitled, "Bush's weapons of mass deceit." The thrust of the piece is that Americans were "misled into war" from the very beginning. He concludes: "Now, it's true that the war removed an evil tyrant. But a democracy's decisions, right or wrong, are supposed to take place with the informed consent of its citizens. That didn't happen this time. And we are a democracy--aren't we?"


This must be it:

http://www.nytimes.com/2003/04/29/opinion/29KRUG.html

April 29, 2003
Matters of Emphasis
By PAUL KRUGMAN


We were not lying," a Bush administration official told ABC News. "But it was just a matter of emphasis." The official was referring to the way the administration hyped the threat that Saddam Hussein posed to the United States. According to the ABC report, the real reason for the war was that the administration "wanted to make a statement." And why Iraq? "Officials acknowledge that Saddam had all the requirements to make him, from their standpoint, the perfect target."

A British newspaper, The Independent, reports that "intelligence agencies on both sides of the Atlantic were furious that briefings they gave political leaders were distorted in the rush to war." One "high-level source" told the paper that "they ignored intelligence assessments which said Iraq was not a threat."

Sure enough, we have yet to find any weapons of mass destruction. It's hard to believe that we won't eventually find some poison gas or crude biological weapons. But those aren't true W.M.D.'s, the sort of weapons that can make a small, poor country a threat to the greatest power the world has ever known. Remember that President Bush made his case for war by warning of a "mushroom cloud." Clearly, Iraq didn't have anything like that — and Mr. Bush must have known that it didn't.

Does it matter that we were misled into war? Some people say that it doesn't: we won, and the Iraqi people have been freed. But we ought to ask some hard questions — not just about Iraq, but about ourselves.

First, why is our compassion so selective? In 2001 the World Health Organization — the same organization we now count on to protect us from SARS — called for a program to fight infectious diseases in poor countries, arguing that it would save the lives of millions of people every year. The U.S. share of the expenses would have been about $10 billion per year — a small fraction of what we will spend on war and occupation. Yet the Bush administration contemptuously dismissed the proposal.

Or consider one of America's first major postwar acts of diplomacy: blocking a plan to send U.N. peacekeepers to Ivory Coast (a former French colony) to enforce a truce in a vicious civil war. The U.S. complains that it will cost too much. And that must be true — we wouldn't let innocent people die just to spite the French, would we?

So it seems that our deep concern for the Iraqi people doesn't extend to suffering people elsewhere. I guess it's just a matter of emphasis. A cynic might point out, however, that saving lives peacefully doesn't offer any occasion to stage a victory parade.

Meanwhile, aren't the leaders of a democratic nation supposed to tell their citizens the truth?

One wonders whether most of the public will ever learn that the original case for war has turned out to be false. In fact, my guess is that most Americans believe that we have found W.M.D.'s. Each potential find gets blaring coverage on TV; how many people catch the later announcement — if it is ever announced — that it was a false alarm? It's a pattern of misinformation that recapitulates the way the war was sold in the first place. Each administration charge against Iraq received prominent coverage; the subsequent debunking did not.

Did the news media feel that it was unpatriotic to question the administration's credibility? Some strange things certainly happened. For example, in September Mr. Bush cited an International Atomic Energy Agency report that he said showed that Saddam was only months from having nuclear weapons. "I don't know what more evidence we need," he said. In fact, the report said no such thing — and for a few hours the lead story on MSNBC's Web site bore the headline "White House: Bush Misstated Report on Iraq." Then the story vanished — not just from the top of the page, but from the site.

Thanks to this pattern of loud assertions and muted or suppressed retractions, the American public probably believes that we went to war to avert an immediate threat — just as it believes that Saddam had something to do with Sept. 11.

Now it's true that the war removed an evil tyrant. But a democracy's decisions, right or wrong, are supposed to take place with the informed consent of its citizens. That didn't happen this time. And we are a democracy — aren't we?

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Postby lukpac » Wed Apr 30, 2003 7:30 pm

Grant wrote:Because he is egotistical, but he also wants to SURVIVE! He is a little weasal. All he cares about is himself. He cares what people think of him. It's an ego boost for him. Why else would he put up posters and statues of his mug allover the place? He would look worse in the world opinion if he had the nuclear or chemical weapons and used them.


That would make sense if not for one problem - what good is an ego boost when you're not in power? Sure, people might be saying "look, what Saddam was saying was true", but what good does it do him if he has to hide out somewhere?

It seems to me if he wanted to boost his ego he would have done whatever he could to save Iraq. And maybe that's exactly what he did (which wasn't much).

If he was so afraid of looking bad by using chemical weapons, why would he have them at all?

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Postby Ron » Thu May 01, 2003 4:01 am

Patrick M wrote:This must be it:

April 29, 2003
Matters of Emphasis
By PAUL KRUGMAN


Yeah, Patrick, that's the editorial I was referring to. Reading it again is just so friggin' frustrating. Sure, politicians lie. That's certainly no secret. And of course this editorial is an exception, but generally speaking the response to these lies from the major news outlets has been tepid at best. Unless you're reading the Village Voice or the like you're likely to remain clueless as to the extent that democracy in the U.S. is being subverted. Also frustrating is that the average Joe just doesn't seem to care. Tax cuts for the wealthiest 5% of Americans? Americans misled re: reasons for war? Nobody seems to be paying attention.
Last edited by Ron on Thu May 01, 2003 5:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby Ron » Thu May 01, 2003 4:19 am

lukpac wrote:It seems to me if he wanted to boost his ego he would have done whatever he could to save Iraq.


Exactly. It would seem that to whatever extent Saddam cares about his reputation, it's his reputation in the eyes of the Iraqi people that would most matter to him. To not put up much of a fight just doesn't make sense in that respect. Maybe I'm dead wrong, but I wonder if the Iraqi people would have vilified him had he used biological/chemical weapons against invading forces. And as I said earlier, if the reason he chose not to was to spare his people further causalities stemming from the retribution that would follow such an attack, then why not spare his people any and all grief by stepping down a month ago and simply avoid the war in the first place? It's all very odd.

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Postby Rspaight » Thu May 01, 2003 8:25 am

Oh yeah. It's going to be a nightmare. But even that may serve American corporate interests as a not-so-easily-subdued Iraq will require a strong American military presence--which is what they've wanted all along. How else can America maintain a degree of control in the area and guarantee a secure source of oil?


Yes, and at that point we become Israel and the Iraqis become the Palestinians. And we all know how terrorism-free Israel is.

That's the thought I kept having while hearing about the clashes between US troops and Iraqi protesters. Those stories sounded *so* familiar...

On a related note, what the heck is going on in Afghanistan?


By most accounts, Kabul is in pretty good shape, but the rest of the country is in the same kind of warlord-ruled chaos that gave rise to the Taliban in the first place.

Ryan
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Postby Ron » Thu May 01, 2003 5:08 pm

Ryan, we're on the same page. I had the same thought re: the Israel/Palestinian "relationship." Twice in the last three days American military has fired into a crowd of Iraqi demonstrators. Yes, that *does* have a familiar ring to it. Imagine how it will play throughout all of Muslimland when pictures of Iraqis in detention camps [which is the logical next step in American efforts to "stabilize" the country] are broadcast in the not-too-distant future.
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Postby Ron » Tue May 06, 2003 6:26 pm

Saddam's son fled the country with $1 billion. Who knows how many more billions Saddam's got. Were I him, I'd funnel as much of that cash as I could spare into al-Qaida's coffers. "He who laughs last . . ."
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Postby Grant » Wed May 07, 2003 3:14 pm

It appears they finally found a mobile chemical/bio lab in Iraq...

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Postby lukpac » Wed May 07, 2003 9:28 pm

Grant wrote:It appears they finally found a mobile chemical/bio lab in Iraq...


Well, the verdict isn't in yet. They've "found" a lot of stuff so far, only to have it all turn out to be bunk.

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Postby Ron » Thu May 08, 2003 3:00 am

But even if this mobile lab turns out to be the real thing, would that justify this war? Let's face it: Americans were duped. But having said that, it doesn't appear that many care. The lesson is clear: there is no liability in lying to the American people [especially when it gives Americans a reason to thump their chests during a jolly good war]. As such, we can expect to see it again and again.
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Postby Ron » Tue Jun 24, 2003 4:51 pm

So why *didn't* Saddam? Here's an excerpt from Maureen Dowd [NY Times op-ed]:

"Could we have been at war with someone who wasn't fighting back? Maybe [Saddam] decided that rather than hit America with biological warfare, he would use psychological warfare, discrediting the U.S. with allies by stripping the anthrax cupboards. Maybe Saddam has been chortling from the sidelines as his guerrillas and Islamic militants kill enough U.S. soldiers to make Americans queasy."

What this means, of course, is that AMERICA HAS BEEN DUPED. Saddam ran off with a billion bucks. America's allies all hate/distrust us. The U.S. will foot the bill for the rebuilding of Iraq. And guerrilla warfare will continue until the very last day of occupation.
Dr. Ron :mrgreen:TM "Do it 'till you're sick of it. Do it 'till you can't do it no more." Jesse Winchester

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Postby mikenycLI » Tue Jun 24, 2003 5:27 pm

Everyone is burned out about this subject, and has turned deaf ears to any factual information. Unfortunately, in a democracy, the people have the right to do this, even in the face of lies.