Rolling Stones...oh dear god

Xenu · Postby **Xenu** » Sun Oct 30, 2005 10:47 pm

So I've been doing some research for new additions to the FAQ. In the process, I have discovered something very unpleasant, which hopefully ISN'T indicative of a trend.

I tested:

a) The Rolling Stones - 2nd pressing with long "Tell Me" (i.e. not the incredibly first early design)
b) The Rolling Stones - later pressing with faded "Tell Me" (German)
c) The above, but the random Australian CD
d) The Japanese disc with long "Tell Me" (POCD edition).

For the most part, CDs a-c had very similar looking waveforms. D) was a bit normalize, but was otherwise also similar.

Problematically, none of them seem to sync.

On *anything*.

This creates...well, a problem. It means London was in the habit of sending analog tape copies from which CDs were mastered, unless there's a better explanation. Unfortunately, while I'd like to assume that the first-pressing Germans were in fact closer to the source (because of small glitches that end up in some of the Japanese discs), there's really no way to tell.

(this would also contradict our original supposition that the London tapes were the pure digital copies extracted from the MoFi masters. Clearly, SOME analog generations were introduced along the line?)

On the positive side, I think that the "later" titles (everything that only appeared in the second batch on, i.e. More Hot Rocks) may turn out to be identical everywhere, and it's almost as a moot point....I edited together a zombie "Route 66" using all of the above versions and the new ABKCO disc, and the only one that sounded audibly different on transition was the new ABKCO, which sports noticably different EQ.

Dammit. Why can't things be simple?

Crummy Old Label Avatar · Postby **Crummy Old Label Avatar** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 3:49 pm

So does this mean that the "forum approved" version of any given disc is now "all 27 different pressings"? I'm glad that I'm satisfied with the recent remasters and am done with it. Life's too short for me to worry about being able to titter if Jagger lets slip a rude and naughty word on the fadeout of "The Under Assistant West Coast Promo Man".

Postby **lukpac** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:22 pm

Funny...Under Assistant is actually one I care about.

Not sure I can say the same about the "they are the same except they aren't" issue, though. Not enough to get excited, anyway.

Xenu · Postby **Xenu** » Mon Oct 31, 2005 5:08 pm

Crummy Old Label Avatar wrote:So does this mean that the "forum approved" version of any given disc is now "all 27 different pressings"?

Well, no. I'm sure it'll matter to some; it doesn't really matter to me. As with far too many things, though, "it doesn't matter" doesn't mean I'm not interested. If we're attempting to make a thorough document, then this sort of miscellany is well within our reach.

Xenu · Postby **Xenu** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 1:25 am

I just compared the "shit" domestic old ABKCO "Let It Bleed" with the first-edition German disc.

Results: they don't sync..and I was surprised that they didn't, as the waveforms looked (and sounded) pretty much identical. Does anybody know the relative release dates for these two discs? I wouldn't be surprised if they were identically sourced.

The London does, FWIW, seem to present the "rawer" tape, as you hear the hiss fade up before certain tracks begin. I'd also like to know whether the "regular" London disc sounds different at all.

Xenu · Postby **Xenu** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 1:34 am

Holy of holies.

Thankfully, the "Mothers Little Helper"s on both German Aftermaths I have (first pressing, latter pressing) cancel out, so maybe the "different versions all have different A-->D transfer" problem is only on discs that have something changed (like self-titled).

Material! I guess I need to shore up on my London cachet...

Postby **lukpac** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 8:32 am

I already told you the Japanese (P25L) Aftermath doesn't match the German. Don't know about sync, but levels are a bit different, and the Japanese fades hiss between tracks (don't believe the German does).

dudelsack · Postby **dudelsack** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 10:48 am

Xenu wrote:Holy of holies.

Thankfully, the "Mothers Little Helper"s on both German Aftermaths I have (first pressing, latter pressing) cancel out, so maybe the "different versions all have different A-->D transfer" problem is only on discs that have something changed (like self-titled).

Material! I guess I need to shore up on my London cachet...

Pretty sure Between The Buttons is the same in all its London iterations, too...

Xenu · Postby **Xenu** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 1:26 pm

lukpac wrote:I already told you the Japanese (P25L) Aftermath doesn't match the German. Don't know about sync, but levels are a bit different, and the Japanese fades hiss between tracks (don't believe the German does).

Yeah, I don't think any of the Japanese ones ('cept for the later batch) match exactly; what I'm saying is that here, the German ones all seem to match.

Speaking of which, does anybody on this board have a "Regular" German LIB?

Phil Elliott · Postby **Phil Elliott** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 5:00 pm

Erm ... I have a LIB with a 12 page booklet, no "digitally remastered" banner in the top left - one of the last available on the shelves in the UK before the Abkcos replaced them. Any good?

dudelsack · Postby **dudelsack** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 5:04 pm

Xenu wrote:
lukpac wrote:I already told you the Japanese (P25L) Aftermath doesn't match the German. Don't know about sync, but levels are a bit different, and the Japanese fades hiss between tracks (don't believe the German does).

Yeah, I don't think any of the Japanese ones ('cept for the later batch) match exactly; what I'm saying is that here, the German ones all seem to match.

Speaking of which, does anybody on this board have a "Regular" German LIB?

Regular as in...what? I've got the 2-page (front/back) booklet LIB, which I presume is the earlier iteration.

Xenu · Postby **Xenu** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 5:52 pm

Phil Elliott wrote:Erm ... I have a LIB with a 12 page booklet, no "digitally remastered" banner in the top left - one of the last available on the shelves in the UK before the Abkcos replaced them. Any good?

Excellent. Might you be able to throw up a short FLAC sample of "Live with Me" (no more than 30 seconds?) I want to see how it compares.

-D

Phil Elliott · Postby **Phil Elliott** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 6:18 pm

I think I goofed - it's 39 seconds long (sarcasm):

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/philelliott/ ... th_me.flac

.

Xenu · Postby **Xenu** » Fri Nov 11, 2005 8:55 pm

Syncs, but doesn't quite cancel out with the first pressing I have (minor EQ differences, I guess). Doesn't sync with the ABKCO.

krabapple · Postby **krabapple** » Sun Nov 13, 2005 8:39 pm

an only mildy related quickie --

is this true?

"I only bought Hot Rocks when it was eventually released in the UK. The US release has been reported here to feature a mono Mother's Little Helper on both the DSD and red book layers. The UK edition has a stereo Mother's Little Helper on the DSD layer, but a mono version on the red book."