Ashcroft mocks librarians opposed to PATRIOT act

Expect plenty of disagreement. Just keep it civil.
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Rspaight
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Postby Rspaight » Tue Sep 23, 2003 2:09 pm

However, a registration scheme wouldn't necessarily have kept the gun out of the hands of the shooter.


Agreed. I was just using it as an example of the sort of thing that wouldn't happen if a pie-in-the-sky gun ban (i.e., all guns magically vanished into thin air) would work (responding to your comment that all such a ban would do would be disarm the victim while the criminal uses a "different tool").

How did I miss this story? Which Burger King? One in Lexington? Richmond Rd, Nicholasville Rd, New Circle?


It was the one in Nicholasville. I used to live there (graduated from high school, in fact), and still have some friends there. It was a *huge* deal locally. I'm guessing it was about two years ago.

Ryan
RQOTW: "I'll make sure that our future is defined not by the letters ACLU, but by the letters USA." -- Mitt Romney

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balthazar
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Postby balthazar » Tue Sep 23, 2003 2:14 pm

I don't think she was *made* helpless. I think many times in life you just *are* helpless. Again, I tend to think if someone wants to do something bad to you, then odds are pretty good they can get away with it. (Assuming you don't have a bunch of body guards, etc.)


Assuming someone wants to do harm to you specifically.

Since you seem to agree that most violent crimes are random, in order to protect against one, you would need to be a) armed and b) prepared at all times. Again, I wouldn't bring a .45 into Fazoli's on the slim odds that I'm going to get shot in there.


If we can agree that move violent crimes are random, if you're not the first victim, this will allow you more reaction time. Also, anyone carrying a concealed weapon is unlikely to be carrying a .45. (I know this is nitpicky). A person is more likely to be carrying small arm, most likely some kind of semiautomatic .22 or at most a .380.

There are other issues at play as well. How well would an average hangdun owner do in such a stressful situation? Would they be able to stop an assailant without killling an innocent bystander? Etc.


Most states that allow concealed carry have fairly tough requirements for acquiring the permit/license to do so, including clean records, psych. evaluations, and/or training. I would contend that one or more of these requirements sets concealed carry owners a bit above other handgun owners.

How would they handle the stressful situation? It's hard to say, I'll admit. Would they be able to stop the assailant without injuring or killing a bystander? The "rules" of gun safety include not pointing the weapon at anything you don't intent to shoot, and knowing what's beyond your target. In a stressful situation it may be easy to forget these. I would think though that the type of person allowed to carry a concealed weapon has the presence of mind to do so safely.
"It's great how you can control 60 musicians with one just stick-- I can't control these fuckers with two!" -- Ian Paice

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Patrick M
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Postby Patrick M » Tue Sep 23, 2003 2:28 pm

Rspaight wrote:It was the one in Nicholasville. I used to live there (graduated from high school, in fact), and still have some friends there. It was a *huge* deal locally. I'm guessing it was about two years ago.

I saw that it was boarded up, but I had no idea why. I may have been in Dayton when the incident happened.

Didn't someone get killed several years ago at the Taco Bell at the corner of New Circle and Russell Cave?

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Rspaight
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Postby Rspaight » Tue Sep 23, 2003 2:37 pm

Didn't someone get killed several years ago at the Taco Bell at the corner of New Circle and Russel Cave?


Hmmmm, don't remember of the top of my head. Sounds vaguely familiar, but can't say for sure.

Ryan
RQOTW: "I'll make sure that our future is defined not by the letters ACLU, but by the letters USA." -- Mitt Romney