Must Own Albums of ______

Just what the name says.
Alandovos
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Must Own Albums of ______

Postby Alandovos » Mon Apr 21, 2003 12:00 am

Thought I'd add a new topic with a hidden question I've been meaning to ask. I'm getting more into Pink Floyd and was wondering where the cutoff for albums is between "must own" and "completest".

I'm not wondering if "The Wall" is better than DSotM but I'd consider both to be "must own". This isn't intended to be a single "best of" or a rank list.

Feel free to do this for other bands, though I'd hope to keep it around classic rock, I really don't care what the "must own" Yani albums are!

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Patrick M
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Postby Patrick M » Mon Apr 21, 2003 12:16 am

This would be a little bit difficult for Pink Floyd because their material spans so much time and, in my estimation, falls into three periods:

early, trippy (up to DSOTM)
middle period that isn't so trippy, but sold lots of records (DSOTM - The Final Cut*)
'we're only in it for the money' period (everything post-Waters)

* I guess you'd also have to classify TFC as either a PF album, or Waters solo with PF as a backing band. I think it's really the latter.

Anyhoo, David McGoodwin is a distant relative of David Gilmour, and Chris M probably knows a boatload more about this than I do, so I'll defer for the time being.

p.s. That's "Yanni."
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prix
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Re: Must Own Albums of ______

Postby prix » Mon Apr 21, 2003 3:19 am

Alandovos wrote:Thought I'd add a new topic with a hidden question I've been meaning to ask. I'm getting more into Pink Floyd and was wondering where the cutoff for albums is between "must own" and "completest".

I'm not wondering if "The Wall" is better than DSotM but I'd consider both to be "must own". This isn't intended to be a single "best of" or a rank list.

Feel free to do this for other bands, though I'd hope to keep it around classic rock, I really don't care what the "must own" Yani albums are!


Let's summarize:

1)the question is "hidden"
2)you are getting into Pink Floyd
3) you are not wondering about "The Wall" or "DSotM"
4)you don't want to know the "best of" or "rank" of Pink Floyd's albums
5)you don't care about Yani

Honestly, your thread makes about as much sense as it's ambiguous title. What, exactly, is the question (if there is one)???

Alandovos
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Postby Alandovos » Mon Apr 21, 2003 9:32 am

Didn't seem that hard (but then again I wrote it).

I'd like to start a thread of the must own albums of bands. I don't mean for this to be a ranking list or discussion of which album is better than another.

Specifically I would like to start with the albums of Pink Floyd.

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Grant
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Postby Grant » Mon Apr 21, 2003 1:00 pm

My cutoff time for Pink Floyd is anything after The Wall. Personally, anything afterward is boring.

Earth Wind & Fire: Faces

Actually, this is kind of tiough for me because some bands come back strong after a slump. Some bands are inconsistient. In some cases like Steely Dan and Rufdus, the band members do solo projects or change directions.

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Postby britre » Mon Apr 21, 2003 3:32 pm

Ok. This is a topic which is so off the map, on the map, and could occupy the whole universe, it really is not good forum conversation.

With that in mind, I will stick with the subject which I read to be "Must own Pink Floyd". Being an expert in the field with close to 100 various items in my collection (please do not consider this bragging) I will attempt an answer.

My personal must own desert island title is "Wish You Were Here" perferably the Quadraphonic version. It has extentions of the material in it's truer form albeit the Stero is good, they sliced and diced for vinyl fittiment. The Quad version was a bit more compressed and fit the grooves better so more material was left in tact. While this degrades the overall sound, the content here is what makes the difference. If you can't get that, then get the best sounding version which is the second generation gold Half Speed 20 bit SBM release, the one without the long box. If thats not availible, then the most recent remaster release is very acceptable.

With Darkside, there are so many versions, the newest SACD is quite good and I reccomend that. For a vinyl version, the German Quadraphonic release is very top end. Both the MFSL lp and CD are also quite good but a bit heavy on the low end like all MFSL recordings.

For The Wall, a must have is the Remastered U.K. vinyl availible in the Back Issues 7 lp box set. This is an amazing pressing! The Remastered CD is equally a good listen, however it appears the US version has some sort of weird compression. The mother of all Wall releases is the Columbia Half Mastered vinyl version which is a kill whomever listen, this LP will run you $500 + if you find it, so it's a little above this discussion, but I would say as a collector it is a must have (mine ran me $250.00 as it had a few vinyl flaws, but trust me it was worth every penny).

There is a German version of Meddle which is amazing, but the CD reissue is very good and listenable. Obscured By Clouds is also a must have.

As far as Animals, it was sort of a experimental phase for Waters and most of the band had lost interest by this poing, making the project not as full and creative as it could have been. Animals is not top of the list, but something to get after you have all the top end LP's.

The Final Cut, is a great outtakes LP, and would have been even better as it was originally intended, as part of The Wall. Could anyone here imagine The Wall as a four LP set? You could listen for hours and it really would have been a superb album, alas the record buying public looses, the record companies decide and control.

Post Floyd, you only need two Waters Albums, one Gilmour LP, and Richard Wright's "Wet Dream". Wet Dream is simmilar to another CD I reveiwed, OSI. "About Face", Gilmour's prime project was a good strong LP, but lacked the most important aspect, Waters lyrics. Pros and Cons, and Amused to Death are must have Roger Waters. Radio Kaos is a album to listen to after you truly discover how genius Waters is! If you start with Kaos, you will never ever try Roger again as it is probably his weakest writing and musical creation.

Post Waterless Floyd I would reccomend listening to Division Bell. I liked Momentary, but that was definitely a sell out album to put some cashflow into the pockets of a few burned out hippies. Division Bell is sort of like a White Album of the remaining Floyd members and it really shows the streangths and weaknesses of Gilmour, Wright, and Mason. Had they all stayed together, I am certain Waters would have improved the content, and most likely they all would have trashed the Kaos project which would have kept Waters on the 100% winning streak.

The future? I have heard some recent work bootleged from Waters. It is not his best and I have a indication this next effort is not going to be a shining moment. I also listened to the last Richard Wright effort. While good, it lacks excitement. I have not heard from Gilmour, and Is Nick Mason even still alive?

My final thought. As much of a die hard Floyd fan as I am, I do believe like the Beatles, all great bands must stop at some point, and retire. The Beatles with the exception of McCartney did just that, and you will note everytime they try to come back, it's crap. This will be the same for the Floyds. The glory has ended, and the body of work stands the test of time. Waters, Wright and Gilmour will never create again what they did in the past, and they should be extremely proud that they did create music which will stand the test of time and generations. A great triumph for a bar band of the swinging sixties. Ya baby!

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Patrick M
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Postby Patrick M » Mon Apr 21, 2003 6:46 pm

britre wrote:If you can't get that, then get the best sounding version which is the second generation gold Half Speed 20 bit SBM release, the one without the long box.

I'm pretty sure your SBM gold CD was not half speed mastered. :wink:

BTW, what's the difference between the longbox gold CD and the non-longbox gold CD? They should be the same, right? Mastered by Doug Sax and/or Gavin Lurssen?

As for the half speed LP...there were two catalog #s, but I think ("assume") the mastering is the same on both.

With Darkside, there are so many versions, the newest SACD is quite good and I reccomend that. For a vinyl version, the German Quadraphonic release is very top end. Both the MFSL lp and CD are also quite good but a bit heavy on the low end like all MFSL recordings.


Don't forget the DRAMATIC DIFFERENCES between the Ultradisc and Ultradisc II!

Also don't forget the MoFis of Meddle, Atom Heart Mother, and The Wall. Remember when MoFi was going to release Ummagumma, then pulled the plug?

The Final Cut, is a great outtakes LP, and would have been even better as it was originally intended, as part of The Wall.


Some of TFC is left over from The Wall, but some of it isn't. I know "Your Possible Pasts" and "The Hero's Return" are supposed to be leftovers.

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Xenu
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Postby Xenu » Mon Apr 21, 2003 8:32 pm

I wish the Floydsters would get off their asses already and finally release something of a "Complete Syd-Era" sort of rarities compilation.

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britre
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Postby britre » Mon Apr 21, 2003 9:52 pm

Patrick M wrote:
britre wrote:If you can't get that, then get the best sounding version which is the second generation gold Half Speed 20 bit SBM release, the one without the long box.

I'm pretty sure your SBM gold CD was not half speed mastered. :wink:

BTW, what's the difference between the longbox gold CD and the non-longbox gold CD? They should be the same, right? Mastered by Doug Sax and/or Gavin Lurssen?

As for the half speed LP...there were two catalog #s, but I think ("assume") the mastering is the same on both.

There are definite sonic differences between the two releases. The initial one was compressed and very low volume almost as if the equalization was set the same as when they mastered off the vinyl. However, you may just be right in the fact the CD is not a half speed master ;)

With Darkside, there are so many versions, the newest SACD is quite good and I reccomend that. For a vinyl version, the German Quadraphonic release is very top end. Both the MFSL lp and CD are also quite good but a bit heavy on the low end like all MFSL recordings.


Don't forget the DRAMATIC DIFFERENCES between the Ultradisc and Ultradisc II!

Also don't forget the MoFis of Meddle, Atom Heart Mother, and The Wall. Remember when MoFi was going to release Ummagumma, then pulled the plug?

Absolutly! There are test pressings of that Umagumma and if anyone gets one, your one lucky cookie! As far as Darkside goes, thats a topic in itself that would fill Luke's server quickly. Lets agree not to discuss Darkside versions.

The Final Cut, is a great outtakes LP, and would have been even better as it was originally intended, as part of The Wall.


Some of TFC is left over from The Wall, but some of it isn't. I know "Your Possible Pasts" and "The Hero's Return" are supposed to be leftovers.


True, but most other cuts are leftovers too. The facts have it that Fletcher Memorial, Two Suns In The Sunset, Southhampton Dock, and TFC title track were all new tunes added by Waters and recorded without the other Floyd members (Gilmour and Mason, Wright was gone as of The Wall), the remaining tunes are extra's from The Wall.

And since we are having fun, check these out;

http://www.thefinalcut.de/english/start.html

http://www.posi.net/personal/finalcut/

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Patrick M
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Postby Patrick M » Mon Apr 21, 2003 10:59 pm

Xenu wrote:I wish the Floydsters would get off their asses already and finally release something of a "Complete Syd-Era" sort of rarities compilation.

<sarcasm>
Once again, McGoodwin has added value to a thread with his incisive, on topic comments.
</sarcasm>

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Postby CDJones » Tue Apr 22, 2003 7:32 am

<<Don't forget the DRAMATIC DIFFERENCES between the Ultradisc and Ultradisc II!>>


<<BTW, what's the difference between the longbox gold CD and the non-longbox gold CD? They should be the same, right? Mastered by Doug Sax and/or Gavin Lurssen?

As for the half speed LP...there were two catalog #s, but I think ("assume") the mastering is the same on both.

There are definite sonic differences between the two releases. The initial one was compressed and very low volume almost as if the equalization was set the same as when they mastered off the vinyl. However, you may just be right in the fact the CD is not a half speed master>>




Before we agree not to discuss this further, what exactly are the differences between the DSOTM UD and UDII??? I've heard all kinds of grumblings that the UD's were better, no the UDII's are better, etc. I always believed the only differences were that MoFi used a different plant to press the UDII's.

In regard to the Mastersound WYWH CD, is your reply above referring to that issue or the Wall vinyl issue?

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Postby lukpac » Tue Apr 22, 2003 8:16 am

CDJones wrote:Before we agree not to discuss this further, what exactly are the differences between the DSOTM UD and UDII??? I've heard all kinds of grumblings that the UD's were better, no the UDII's are better, etc. I always believed the only differences were that MoFi used a different plant to press the UDII's.


And that belief would be correct. The two are digitally identical (I'm not yet aware of a case where they *aren't* identical). Now, it's possible the UDI was pressed better, but nevertheless, the actual mastering is the same. Don't like the sound of the UDII? Burn it to CD-R...

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Postby CDJones » Tue Apr 22, 2003 9:05 am

lukpac wrote:
CDJones wrote:Before we agree not to discuss this further, what exactly are the differences between the DSOTM UD and UDII??? I've heard all kinds of grumblings that the UD's were better, no the UDII's are better, etc. I always believed the only differences were that MoFi used a different plant to press the UDII's.


And that belief would be correct. The two are digitally identical (I'm not yet aware of a case where they *aren't* identical). Now, it's possible the UDI was pressed better, but nevertheless, the actual mastering is the same. Don't like the sound of the UDII? Burn it to CD-R...
Good. Now that that's cleared up, on to WYWH. This is the first I've heard about any differences between the slip case and longbox versions of the Mastersound reissue. I've been satisfied with the longbox disc and was under the distinct impression that the slip cases were meant to get rid of the horrid box and get the CD's into the CD bins. I'm not aware that any changes were made to the contents.

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Postby britre » Tue Apr 22, 2003 9:07 am

CDJones wrote:<<Don't forget the DRAMATIC DIFFERENCES between the Ultradisc and Ultradisc II!>>


<<BTW, what's the difference between the longbox gold CD and the non-longbox gold CD? They should be the same, right? Mastered by Doug Sax and/or Gavin Lurssen?

As for the half speed LP...there were two catalog #s, but I think ("assume") the mastering is the same on both.

There are definite sonic differences between the two releases. The initial one was compressed and very low volume almost as if the equalization was set the same as when they mastered off the vinyl. However, you may just be right in the fact the CD is not a half speed master>>




Before we agree not to discuss this further, what exactly are the differences between the DSOTM UD and UDII??? I've heard all kinds of grumblings that the UD's were better, no the UDII's are better, etc. I always believed the only differences were that MoFi used a different plant to press the UDII's.

In regard to the Mastersound WYWH CD, is your reply above referring to that issue or the Wall vinyl issue?


The above refers to the two Gold 20 bit SBM releases of WYWH, the UD1/UD2 Darkside is a different subject. Sorry for the bad quoting and response

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Patrick M
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Postby Patrick M » Tue Apr 22, 2003 12:14 pm

CDJones wrote:There are definite sonic differences between the two releases. The initial one was compressed and very low volume almost as if the equalization was set the same as when they mastered off the vinyl. However, you may just be right in the fact the CD is not a half speed master


Interesting...I hadn't heard that before w.r.t. the half-speed vinyl of WYWH. I think mine is the second pressing. IIRC, on mine, they just stuck a clear sticker with the updated catalog # over the original catalog # on the jacket.

I don't think you can have a half-speed mastered CD, since the whole 'half speed mastering' thing refers to how you cut vinyl. Of course, if I'm wrong, Luke will be all over it pronto.