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 Post subject: Gays versus Mormons
PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 1:06 pm 
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So yeah, I know that African American turnout in CA was really a larger factor in passing Prop 8, but I couldn't be more pissed at the LDS church right now if I tried. In the words of Bill Maher: they already have their own state (and, in the spirit of Jon Stewart: it seems a bit odd that the Mormons would want to dictate marriage restrictions to anybody else).

Massachusetts should really start an "East Hollywood" campaign to lure all of the gays from California to the East Coast. Think of how paradigm-shifting that could be.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 1:16 pm 
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Massachusetts should really start an "East Hollywood" campaign to lure all of the gays from California to the East Coast.


And this is precisely why Apple gave $100,000 to the anti-Prop 8 cause.

It pisses me off to end. I just can't understand how somebody could hate someone else so much that they would go out of their way to deny them basic rights, when NO ONE is not being harmed by it AT ALL.

We came a long way last night, but we have a long way yet to go.

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 Post subject: Re: Gays versus Mormons
PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 4:52 pm 
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Xenu wrote:
So yeah, I know that African American turnout in CA was really a larger factor in passing Prop 8,


The most discriminated against minority group in the history of the country is one of the most discriminating groups when it comes down to it. They will be reminded of this time and time again.

Progress is being made. It's just a very slow process.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 5:29 pm 
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And, it's another reason why theocratic notions are like poison. They often blind man in regard to his own struggles.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 05, 2008 9:53 pm 
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David R. Modny wrote:
And, it's another reason why theocratic notions are like poison. They often blind man in regard to his own struggles.


Blind and deaf. I have a black friend that sent me a mass email she put together saying that the new dollar coin should not be accepted as change back from a purchase, but should be rejected outright because the words "In God We Trust" are nowhere to be found on this newer coin. The email is actually lacking any text explaining the position, and in fact looked like a virus sent by someone else with a subject and only picture attachment. It was not really well thought out before clicking the send button.

While I have not looked closely at the coin in question, I feel that everyone should have the right to worship the God they choose, or not accept any God if they choose or believe that their power comes from an alternate higher one, or comes simply from good eating and exercise. And that whatever power and where ever it comes from, the words on a coin certainly do not provide power or certify any existence of a such a concept.

But you know, I am not going to bother explaining to her of her flawed value in the words on a coin. She might not be open minded and intelligent enough to grasp the concept of freedom to choose and acceptance of others beliefs. She has hinted at lacking creative independent thinking.

I'll let her fly away without an honest discussion. Sometimes that is the best course of action. I've only known her for a year anyway.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 9:10 am 
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That's always struck me as funny. Some people profess to believe in an all-powerful, eternal god that literally controls everything in the known universe, and then freak out over trivial things like "In God We Trust" on money (or Wal-Mart greeters saying "Happy Holidays" instead of "Merry Christmas") as a mortal threat to that pandimensional superbeing.

If they *really* had faith in their religion, why would they care about such things? To me, it shows a deep *lack* of faith and a desperate craving for reinforcement of their beliefs.

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:25 pm 
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Gay Marriages Allowed in Connecticut
By JOHN CHRISTOFFERSEN

AP
posted: 13 MINUTES AGO

NEW HAVEN, Conn. (Nov. 12) - Same-sex couples began marrying in Connecticut on Wednesday after a judge cleared the way, a partial rebound for gay-rights activists still enraged over the vote last week that cost them the right to wed in California.

Protests spread across the country over the loss in California, but in New Haven, bubbles and white balloons bounced in the chilly autumn air as well-wishers cheered the marriage of Peg Oliveira and Jennifer Vickery. They wed outside City Hall, next to a statue commemorating the Amistad slave ship's struggle for freedom, less than two hours after a judge made gay marriage a reality in Connecticut.

Winning the Right to WedDouglas Healey, AP7 photos Gay couples held wedding ceremonies in Connecticut Wednesday, hours after a judge's ruling cleared the last legal hurdle to same-sex nuptials. Here, Peg Oliveira, in a tan coat, holds the hand of her partner, Jennifer Vickery, as a judge officiates at their New Haven wedding, one of the first in the state.

Despite the roaring traffic and clicking cameras, "It was surprisingly quiet," Oliveira said after the brief ceremony. "Everything else dissolved, and it was just the two of us. It was so much more personal and powerful in us committing to one another, and so much less about the people around us."

The Connecticut Supreme Court ruled 4-3 on Oct. 10 that same-sex couples have the right to wed rather than accept a 2005 civil union law designed to give them the same rights as married couples. A lower-court judge entered a final order permitting same-sex marriage Wednesday morning.

"Today, Connecticut sends a message of hope an inspiration to lesbian and gay people throughout this country who simply want to be treated as equal citizens by their government," said the plaintiff's attorney, Bennett Klein.

There was no comparison between civil unions and marriage for Robin Levine-Ritterman and Barbara Levine-Ritterman, who obtained a civil union in 2005 and were among eight same-sex couples who sued for the right to marry.

"We didn't do it with pride or joy," Barbara Levine-Ritterman said of getting the civil-union license. "It felt gritty to be in a separate line."
Judge Makes Gay Marriage Legal in ConnecticutGay marriage is legal in Connecticut now that a judge has cleared the way. (Nov. 12)
On Wednesday, however, she proudly held up the first same-sex marriage license issued in New Haven as about 100 people applauded outside City Hall. She and her betrothed, who held red roses, plan to marry in May.

"It's thrilling today," Barbara Levine-Ritterman said. "We are all in one line for one form. Love is love, and the state recognizes it."
Massachusetts is the only other state that allows gay marriages. Like the highest courts in that state and Connecticut, the California Supreme Court had ruled that same-sex marriage is legal this spring, but after thousands such unions were conducted in that state California voters last week approved a referendum banning the practice.

Constitutional amendments to ban gay marriage also passed last week in Arizona and Florida, and Arkansas voters approved a measure banning unmarried couples from serving as adoptive or foster parents.
The California vote has sparked protests and several lawsuits asking that state's Supreme Court to overturn the prohibition.

A group of Southern California activists have launched an effort to have simultaneous protests outside state houses and city halls in every U.S. state on Saturday. Word of the event has spread through social networking sites such as Facebook, and protests have been scheduled outside the U.S. Capitol and in more than 100 cities.

In Connecticut, celebrating couples, some carrying red roses, streamed into the clerk's office to get their licenses.

Manchester Town Clerk Joseph Camposeo, president of the Connecticut Town Clerks Association, said clerks in the state's 169 communities were advised by e-mail shortly after 9:30 a.m. they could start issuing marriage licenses to gay couples.

"The feedback I'm getting from other clerks is that we're all at the ready, but no one really has a sense yet of what kind of volume we're going to get," he said.

According to the state public health department, 2,032 civil union licenses were issued in Connecticut between October 2005 and July 2008.
The health department had new marriage applications printed that reflect the change. Instead of putting one name under "bride" and the other under "groom," couples will see two boxes marked "bride/groom/spouse."
Connecticut voters could have opened the door to ending gay marriage last week by voting for a constitutional convention to amend the state's constitution, but the measure was defeated.

Peter Wolfgang, the executive director of the Family Institute of Connecticut, a gay-marriage opponent, acknowledged that banning gay weddings in Connecticut will be difficult but vowed not to give up. He condemned the high court's decision as undemocratic.
"Unlike California, we did not have a remedy," Wolfgang said. "It must be overturned with patience, determination and fortitude."

The state's 2005 civil union law will remain on the books, at least for now. Same-sex couples can continue to enter civil unions, which give them the same legal rights and privileges in Connecticut as married couples without the status of being married. Several states, including California, allow domestic partnerships or civil unions for same-sex couples.

Associated Press writers Susan Haigh in Hartford, Conn., and Lisa Leff in San Francisco contributed to this report.

Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. The information contained in the AP news report might be published, broadcast, rewritten and otherwise distributed without any prior written authority of The AP. It happens all the time.
2008-11-12 09:52:05


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 Post subject: Re: Gays versus Mormons
PostPosted: Fri Aug 27, 2010 4:16 pm 
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It does look like those defenders of Prop 8 got their asses kicked hard in this recent ruling by Judge Walker. And now are going to have a much more uphill battle as it advances to the next level. I don't think they ever thought it would or could turn out quite so bad for defenders of Prop 8 in California.

The ruling does not leave much area for further defense, other than to keep saying gays are sick, bad for kids, bad for society, and simply a second class group who never were permitted to marry and certainly should not be now. It's tradition man, we must uphold tradition!!

See what pisses me off is that California was always ahead of the other states, very progressive. We always bounced back quicker in recessions, had tech, music, films, TV, etc. industries that made sure we were always ahead of the pack.

And now, we are among the highest in unemployment and higher in defaulted mortgages than any other state. The state is flat broke and busted. It really feels different here now than it did five years ago.

And having gay marriages legal in California would have brought some money into our state, supply business for caterers, florists, wedding planners, and marriage licenses, tax revenue, etc. So the unconstitutionality of 8 is real as is the financial hit we as a state have taken.

California might no longer be ahead of the class so far as tech, entertainment, and economy. And that 8 originally passed is symbolic of this new era for California. It's tough times ahead regardless of the final outcome.


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