http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=s ... nm/iraq_dc
POSSIBLE BLISTER GAS ARMS
Denmark said its troops had found 36 mortar shells buried in southern Iraq that initial chemical weapons tests showed could contain blister gas. The shells had been buried for at least 10 years and the site may contain another 100, it said.
"All the instruments showed indications of the same type of chemical compound, namely blister gas," the Danish Army Operational Command said on its Web site, cautioning further tests were needed. Final results were likely in about two days.
Blister gas, an illegal weapon which Saddam said he had destroyed, was used extensively against the Iranians during the 1980-1988 Iran-Iraq war.
Icelandic bomb experts working with the Danes said the 120mm shells were concealed in road construction some 45 miles south of Amara and close to the Iranian border.
President Bush ordered U.S.-led forces to invade Iraq after accusing Saddam of possessing weapons of mass destruction. No such arms have been found so far.
Former U.S. Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill, fired in December 2002 as part of a shake-up of Bush's economic team, said in a new book "The Price of Loyalty" the president entered office in January 2001 intent on invading Iraq.
O'Neill, who likened Bush at cabinet meetings to a "blind man in a room full of deaf people," was quoted in the book as saying: "It was all about finding a way to do it... The president saying, 'Go find me a way to do this'."
"For me, the notion of pre-emption, that the U.S. has the unilateral right to do whatever we decide to do, is a really huge leap," O'Neill said in a CBS interview to be aired on Sunday to promote the book by journalist Ron Suskind.
The White House rejected O'Neill's charges.
Possible blister gas found in Iraq + Paul O'Neill is bitter
-
Rspaight
- Posts: 4386
- Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 10:48 am
- Location: The Reality-Based Community
- Contact:
Here's a story from CNN. We'll see if it pans out. If it does, it'll be the first real find -- a bunch of old, decaying shells buried for at least a decade. With blister gas -- basically mustard gas, I guess. Nasty stuff, but not exactly what I'd call a WMD (it ain't nerve gas) and relatively easy to make. But still, honest-to-goodness chemical weapons.
From http://www.twotigersonline.com/m8.html :
Ryan
Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq
Mortars thought to hold blister agent left over from war with Iran
Sunday, January 11, 2004 Posted: 12:15 AM EST (0515 GMT)
BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Danish troops have found suspicious mortar shells in southern Iraq that officials believe contain blister agents, the United States and Denmark announced Saturday.
Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, a U.S. Army spokesman, said Saturday that the 120 mm mortars were filled with liquid.
The shells are at least 10 years old, and a U.S. Army official said he suspects the ordnance was surplus from the Iran-Iraq war in the mid-1980s. Blister agents are used in chemical weapons.
A release on the Danish army operational command Web site said that in a routine collection of old ammunition, the 36 heavy mortar grenades were found in a dried-up marsh Friday. They were buried and packed in plastic.
"Most were wrapped in plastic bags, and some were leaking," Kimmitt said.
The shells were found 20 kilometers (12 miles) north of the city of Qurnah by Danish engineers and Icelandic munitions experts.
Several hundred Danish soldiers are working with a British-led multinational force responsible for security in southern Iraq.
Both the U.S. and British governments cited the threat of illicit weapons of mass destruction as a main reason for launching the Iraq war. However, no such weapons have been found so far.
The U.S. pulled 400 weapons-disposal experts from Iraq this month in what The New York Times called "a sign that [the] administration might have lowered its sights." The move raised suspicions that weapons are unlikely to be found.
The White House played down the move, saying the group focused on hunting weapons was remaining in Iraq.
From http://www.twotigersonline.com/m8.html :
BLISTER GAS can be either an inhaled agent or a contact agent. It cannot be smelled easily and is usually used to harass rather than kill. The time it takes to affect an individual depends on many factors, but it causes severe skin blisters, completely destroys the skin tissue, and has a persistence time of 1 to 54 days. This form of injury is particularly ugly. Blister gas is a Soviet development, based on improvements in Mustard gas used extensively during World War I. Mustard gas was one type of blister gas used extensively in World War I and many veterans have proof by long-lasting scars.
Ryan
Suspicious shells found in southern Iraq
Mortars thought to hold blister agent left over from war with Iran
Sunday, January 11, 2004 Posted: 12:15 AM EST (0515 GMT)
BAGHDAD, Iraq (CNN) -- Danish troops have found suspicious mortar shells in southern Iraq that officials believe contain blister agents, the United States and Denmark announced Saturday.
Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, a U.S. Army spokesman, said Saturday that the 120 mm mortars were filled with liquid.
The shells are at least 10 years old, and a U.S. Army official said he suspects the ordnance was surplus from the Iran-Iraq war in the mid-1980s. Blister agents are used in chemical weapons.
A release on the Danish army operational command Web site said that in a routine collection of old ammunition, the 36 heavy mortar grenades were found in a dried-up marsh Friday. They were buried and packed in plastic.
"Most were wrapped in plastic bags, and some were leaking," Kimmitt said.
The shells were found 20 kilometers (12 miles) north of the city of Qurnah by Danish engineers and Icelandic munitions experts.
Several hundred Danish soldiers are working with a British-led multinational force responsible for security in southern Iraq.
Both the U.S. and British governments cited the threat of illicit weapons of mass destruction as a main reason for launching the Iraq war. However, no such weapons have been found so far.
The U.S. pulled 400 weapons-disposal experts from Iraq this month in what The New York Times called "a sign that [the] administration might have lowered its sights." The move raised suspicions that weapons are unlikely to be found.
The White House played down the move, saying the group focused on hunting weapons was remaining in Iraq.
RQOTW: "I'll make sure that our future is defined not by the letters ACLU, but by the letters USA." -- Mitt Romney
O'Neill really *is* bitter.
Ex US-Treasury Chief: Saw No Evidence of Iraq WMDs
By Adam Entous
CRAWFORD, Texas (Reuters) - Former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill said he never saw any evidence that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction -- President Bush's main justification for going to war -- and was told "deficits don't matter" when he warned of a looming fiscal crisis.
In a new book chronicling his rocky two-year tenure and in an interview with CBS's "60 Minutes" aired on Sunday, O'Neill said removing Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein was a top priority at Bush's very first National Security Council meeting -- within days of the inauguration and eight months before the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.
O'Neill, fired in a shake-up of Bush's economic team in December 2002, told CBS the discussion of Iraq continued at the next National Security Council meeting two days later and that he was given internal memos, including one outlining a "Plan for post-Saddam Iraq."
"In the 23 months I was there, I never saw anything that I would characterize as evidence of weapons of mass destruction," O'Neill told Time magazine in a separate interview. "There were allegations and assertions by people... To me there is a difference between real evidence and everything else."
O'Neill also raised objections to a new round of tax cuts and said the president balked at his more aggressive plan to combat corporate crime after a string of accounting scandals because of opposition from "the corporate crowd," a key constituency.
O'Neill said he tried to warn Vice President Dick Cheney that growing budget deficits -- expected to top $500 billion this fiscal year alone -- posed a threat to the U.S. economy.
Cheney cut him off. "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter," he said, according to excerpts. Cheney continued: "We won the midterms (congressional elections). This is our due."
A month later, Cheney told the Treasury secretary he was fired.
The vice president's office had no immediate comment, but John Snow, who replaced O'Neill, insisted that deficits "do matter" to the administration. "We're not happy about the size of these deficits. They're larger than they should be," Snow told ABC's "This Week," adding that Bush was committed to cutting them in half over the next five years.
According to former Wall Street Journal reporter Ron Suskind, author of "The Price of Loyalty" on O'Neill's tenure, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld called the former Treasury secretary and urged him not to contribute to the book. Suskind told CBS "I think it was the White House concerned" -- not a warning or a threat.
Democrats seized on the account, particularly O'Neill's charges that Bush entered office intent on invading Iraq and was in search of a way to go about it.
"What Paul O'Neill says... is what a lot of other people are beginning to conclude -- that there was an overstatement by the Bush administration of the weapons of mass destruction part of the argument for going to war against Saddam Hussein," Democratic presidential candidate Joseph Lieberman, a U.S. senator from Connecticut, told "Fox News Sunday."
'BLIND MAN'
In the CBS interview, O'Neill likened Bush at Cabinet meetings to "a blind man in a room full of deaf people." When he went in for his first one-on-one meeting with Bush "with a long list of things to talk about..., I was surprised that it turned out me talking, and the president just listening. As I recall ... it was mostly a monologue," O'Neill said.
Democratic presidential hopeful Richard Gephardt, a U.S. congressman from Missouri, said he had a similar impression of Bush, telling CBS' "Face the Nation" program: "He is a nice man. And he's a smart man. But he doesn't have experience. He doesn't have knowledge. And he has no curiosity."
The White House defended Bush.
"I know how he leads, I know how he manages.... He drives the meetings, tough questions, he likes dissent, he likes to see debate," Commerce Secretary Don Evans told CNN's "Late Edition."
Republican Rep. Mark Foley of Florida accused O'Neill of taking "a Shakespearean approach to advance his career and his book sales. Not since Julius Caesar have I seen such a blatant stab in the back. Et tu, Mr. O'Neill?"
Ex US-Treasury Chief: Saw No Evidence of Iraq WMDs
By Adam Entous
CRAWFORD, Texas (Reuters) - Former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill said he never saw any evidence that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction -- President Bush's main justification for going to war -- and was told "deficits don't matter" when he warned of a looming fiscal crisis.
In a new book chronicling his rocky two-year tenure and in an interview with CBS's "60 Minutes" aired on Sunday, O'Neill said removing Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein was a top priority at Bush's very first National Security Council meeting -- within days of the inauguration and eight months before the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks.
O'Neill, fired in a shake-up of Bush's economic team in December 2002, told CBS the discussion of Iraq continued at the next National Security Council meeting two days later and that he was given internal memos, including one outlining a "Plan for post-Saddam Iraq."
"In the 23 months I was there, I never saw anything that I would characterize as evidence of weapons of mass destruction," O'Neill told Time magazine in a separate interview. "There were allegations and assertions by people... To me there is a difference between real evidence and everything else."
O'Neill also raised objections to a new round of tax cuts and said the president balked at his more aggressive plan to combat corporate crime after a string of accounting scandals because of opposition from "the corporate crowd," a key constituency.
O'Neill said he tried to warn Vice President Dick Cheney that growing budget deficits -- expected to top $500 billion this fiscal year alone -- posed a threat to the U.S. economy.
Cheney cut him off. "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter," he said, according to excerpts. Cheney continued: "We won the midterms (congressional elections). This is our due."
A month later, Cheney told the Treasury secretary he was fired.
The vice president's office had no immediate comment, but John Snow, who replaced O'Neill, insisted that deficits "do matter" to the administration. "We're not happy about the size of these deficits. They're larger than they should be," Snow told ABC's "This Week," adding that Bush was committed to cutting them in half over the next five years.
According to former Wall Street Journal reporter Ron Suskind, author of "The Price of Loyalty" on O'Neill's tenure, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld called the former Treasury secretary and urged him not to contribute to the book. Suskind told CBS "I think it was the White House concerned" -- not a warning or a threat.
Democrats seized on the account, particularly O'Neill's charges that Bush entered office intent on invading Iraq and was in search of a way to go about it.
"What Paul O'Neill says... is what a lot of other people are beginning to conclude -- that there was an overstatement by the Bush administration of the weapons of mass destruction part of the argument for going to war against Saddam Hussein," Democratic presidential candidate Joseph Lieberman, a U.S. senator from Connecticut, told "Fox News Sunday."
'BLIND MAN'
In the CBS interview, O'Neill likened Bush at Cabinet meetings to "a blind man in a room full of deaf people." When he went in for his first one-on-one meeting with Bush "with a long list of things to talk about..., I was surprised that it turned out me talking, and the president just listening. As I recall ... it was mostly a monologue," O'Neill said.
Democratic presidential hopeful Richard Gephardt, a U.S. congressman from Missouri, said he had a similar impression of Bush, telling CBS' "Face the Nation" program: "He is a nice man. And he's a smart man. But he doesn't have experience. He doesn't have knowledge. And he has no curiosity."
The White House defended Bush.
"I know how he leads, I know how he manages.... He drives the meetings, tough questions, he likes dissent, he likes to see debate," Commerce Secretary Don Evans told CNN's "Late Edition."
Republican Rep. Mark Foley of Florida accused O'Neill of taking "a Shakespearean approach to advance his career and his book sales. Not since Julius Caesar have I seen such a blatant stab in the back. Et tu, Mr. O'Neill?"
-
TSmithPage
- Posts: 67
- Joined: Sat Apr 12, 2003 9:20 pm
- Contact:
Patrick M wrote:Republican Rep. Mark Foley of Florida accused O'Neill of taking "a Shakespearean approach to advance his career and his book sales. Not since Julius Caesar have I seen such a blatant stab in the back. Et tu, Mr. O'Neill?"
Interesting comment, given that O'Neill recently said the reason he was making his criticisms public was because he was rich and Bush's defenders couldn't hurt him. Kinda inconsistent with Foley's suggestion that O'Neill is doing this for money (i.e., career and book sales).
-
lukpac
- Top Dog and Sellout
- Posts: 4592
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2003 11:51 pm
- Location: Madison, WI
- Contact:
Rspaight wrote:We'll see if it pans out.
It didn't:
Danish army: Iraqi shells WMD-free
Sunday, January 18, 2004 Posted: 10:26 AM EST (1526 GMT)
COPENHAGEN, Denmark -- Mortar shells found in Iraq and believed to be suspicious in fact contained no chemical agents, the Danish army said after a week of tests.
The 36 shells, found 20 kilometers (12 miles) north of the city of Qurnah in southern Iraq on January 9, had initially been thought by Danish and British troops to contain a blister agent.
But further tests carried out in southern Iraq and the United States were negative, the Danish army said in a statement on Sunday, The Associated Press reported.
It was unclear why the initial field tests were wrong, the Danish army said from its headquarters in Karup, 265 km northwest of Copenhagen.
"The Danish Army Operational Command will now investigate what could be the cause to this," the statement said. It added that the testing kits would be sent to Denmark for examination.
U.S. Army officials had said the 120 mm shells, which are at least 10 years old, was surplus from the Iran-Iraq war in the mid-1980s. Blister agents are used in chemical weapons.
Several hundred Danish soldiers are working with a British-led multinational force responsible for security in southern Iraq.
Both the U.S. and British governments cited the threat of illicit weapons of mass destruction as a main reason for launching the Iraq war. However, no such weapons have been found so far.
The U.S. pulled 400 weapons-disposal experts from Iraq this month in what The New York Times called "a sign that [the] administration might have lowered its sights." The move raised suspicions that weapons are unlikely to be found.
The White House played down the move, saying the group focused on hunting weapons was remaining in Iraq.
Copyright 2004 CNN. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. Associated Press contributed to this report.
"I know because it is impossible for a tape to hold the compression levels of these treble boosted MFSL's like Something/Anything. The metal particulate on the tape would shatter and all you'd hear is distortion if even that." - VD
-
Rspaight
- Posts: 4386
- Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 10:48 am
- Location: The Reality-Based Community
- Contact:
This is getting to be comical.
"Look! WMD! Right there! Oh, uh... never mind. Just pesticide. Send it to DeLay."
"Mobile weapons labs! We found mobile weapons labs! Smoking gun! Hey, everyone! Er, what? Filling surveillance balloons? Sold by the British? Darn."
"NUCULAR WEAPONS PARTS! We found nukes! Right here... under this guy's rose bushes? Over ten years old? Huh."
"Oooooh! Scary toxin in this guy's fridge! Development continues! Evil! Evil! Wait a sec... Botox? Naturally occurring? *We* sold it to them? Crap."
"Blister gas! We got blister gas! In *shells*! That's a real weapon! Why, I bet he was planning to launch these at Des Moines! Think of the horror! What? Nothing? False alarm? Well, what the hell did we invade for again?"
Ryan
"Look! WMD! Right there! Oh, uh... never mind. Just pesticide. Send it to DeLay."
"Mobile weapons labs! We found mobile weapons labs! Smoking gun! Hey, everyone! Er, what? Filling surveillance balloons? Sold by the British? Darn."
"NUCULAR WEAPONS PARTS! We found nukes! Right here... under this guy's rose bushes? Over ten years old? Huh."
"Oooooh! Scary toxin in this guy's fridge! Development continues! Evil! Evil! Wait a sec... Botox? Naturally occurring? *We* sold it to them? Crap."
"Blister gas! We got blister gas! In *shells*! That's a real weapon! Why, I bet he was planning to launch these at Des Moines! Think of the horror! What? Nothing? False alarm? Well, what the hell did we invade for again?"
Ryan
RQOTW: "I'll make sure that our future is defined not by the letters ACLU, but by the letters USA." -- Mitt Romney