MIAMI, Florida (AP) -- U.S. Rep. Katherine Harris told a religious journal that separation of church and state is "a lie" and God and the nation's founding fathers did not intend the country be "a nation of secular laws."
The Republican candidate for U.S. Senate also said that if Christians are not elected, politicians will "legislate sin," including abortion and gay marriage.
Harris made the comments -- which she clarified Saturday -- in the Florida Baptist Witness, the weekly journal of the Florida Baptist State Convention, which interviewed political candidates and asked them about religion and their positions on issues.
Separation of church and state is "a lie we have been told," Harris said in the interview, published Thursday, saying separating religion and politics is "wrong because God is the one who chooses our rulers."
Electing non-Christians a 'legislative sin'
"If you're not electing Christians, then in essence you are going to legislate sin," Harris said.
Her comments drew criticism, including some from fellow Republicans who called them offensive and not representative of the party.
Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D-Florida, who is Jewish, told the Orlando Sentinel that she was "disgusted" by the comments.
Harris' campaign released a statement Saturday saying she had been "speaking to a Christian audience, addressing a common misperception that people of faith should not be actively involved in government."
The comments reflected "her deep grounding in Judeo-Christian values," the statement said, adding that Harris had previously supported pro-Israel legislation and legislation recognizing the Holocaust.
Harris' opponents in the GOP primary also gave interviews to the Florida Baptist Witness but made more general statements on their faith.
Harris, 49, faced widespread criticism for her role overseeing the 2000 presidential recount as Florida's secretary of state.
State GOP leaders -- including Gov. Jeb Bush -- don't think she can win against Democratic Sen. Bill Nelson in November. Fundraising has lagged, frustrated campaign workers have defected in droves and the issues have been overshadowed by news of her dealings with a corrupt defense contractor who gave her $32,000 in illegal campaign contributions.
If you're not electing Christians, you will legislate sin
If you're not electing Christians, you will legislate sin
"When people speak to you about a preventive war, you tell them to go and fight it. After my experience, I have come to hate war." – Dwight D. Eisenhower
"Neither slave nor tyrant." - Basque motto
"Neither slave nor tyrant." - Basque motto
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lukpac
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Re: If you're not electing Christians, you will legislate si
MK wrote:The comments reflected "her deep grounding in Judeo-Christian values," the statement said, adding that Harris had previously supported pro-Israel legislation and legislation recognizing the Holocaust.
That makes it ok. As long as you don't forget the Jews.
"I know because it is impossible for a tape to hold the compression levels of these treble boosted MFSL's like Something/Anything. The metal particulate on the tape would shatter and all you'd hear is distortion if even that." - VD
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Rspaight
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What if you elect Christians who are pro-choice and pro-gay marriage? Does that still fit her ideal of a theocracy, or is it strictly a right-wing theocracy?
And if "God is the one who chooses our rulers," then what does it matter who we vote for? (Besides, Katherine Harris was the one who chose our ruler in 2000. Make of that what you will.)
Religious nuts are so confusing.
I've bolded my favorite quote below:
Harris' comments draw fierce reaction
Political and religious officials criticize the candidate's comments on electing Christians.
Jim Stratton
Sentinel Staff Writer
August 26, 2006
U.S. Rep. Katherine Harris said this week that God did not intend for the United States to be a "nation of secular laws" and that a failure to elect Christians to political office will allow lawmaking bodies to "legislate sin."
The remarks, published in the weekly journal of the Florida Baptist State Convention, unleashed a torrent of criticism from political and religious officials.
U.S. Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D-Weston, said she was "disgusted" by the comments "and deeply disappointed in Rep. Harris personally."
Harris, Wasserman Schultz said, "clearly shows that she does not deserve to be a representative. . . ."
State Rep. Irv Slosberg, D-Boca Raton, demanded an apology, saying the statements were "outrageous, even by her standards."
"What is going through this woman's mind?" said Slosberg who, like Wasserman Schultz, is Jewish. "We do not live in a theocracy."
The criticism was not limited to Democrats.
Ruby Brooks, a veteran Tampa Bay Republican activist, said Harris' remarks "were offensive to me as a Christian and a Republican."
"To me, it's the height of hubris," said Brooks, a former Largo Republican Club president and former member of the Pinellas County Republican Executive Committee.
And Jillian Hasner, executive director of the Republican Jewish Coalition, said: "I don't think it's representative of the Republican Party at all. Our party is much bigger and better than Katherine Harris is trying to make it."
The fallout follows an interview published in the Florida Baptist Witness, the weekly journal of the Florida Baptist State Convention. Witness editors interviewed candidates for office asking them to describe their faith and positions on certain issues.
Harris said her religious beliefs "animate" everything she does, including her votes in Congress.
She then warned voters that if they do not send Christians to office, they risk creating a government that is doomed to fail.
"If you are not electing Christians, tried and true, under public scrutiny and pressure, if you're not electing Christians, then in essence you are going to legislate sin," she told interviewers, citing abortion and gay marriage as two examples of that sin.
"Whenever we legislate sin," she said, "and we say abortion is permissible and we say gay unions are permissible, then average citizens who are not Christians, because they don't know better, we are leading them astray and it's wrong. . . ."
Harris also said the separation of church and state is a "lie we have been told" to keep religious people out of politics.
In reality, she said, "we have to have the faithful in government" because that is God's will. Separating religion and politics is "so wrong because God is the one who chooses our rulers," she said.
"And if we are the ones not actively involved in electing those godly men and women," then "we're going to have a nation of secular laws. That's not what our founding fathers intended and that's [sic] certainly isn't what God intended."
Harris campaign spokesman Jennifer Marks would not say what alternative to "a nation of secular laws" Harris would support. She would not answer questions about the Harris interview and, instead, released a two-sentence statement.
"Congresswoman Harris encourages Americans from all walks of life and faith to participate in our government," it stated. "She continues to be an unwavering advocate of religious rights and freedoms."
The notion that non-Christians "don't know better" or are less suited to govern disturbed Rabbi Rick Sherwin, president of the Greater Orlando Board of Rabbis.
"Anybody who claims to have a monopoly on God," he said, "doesn't understand the strength of America."
Sherwin and others also said Harris appeared to be voicing support for a religious state when she said God and the founding fathers did not intend the U.S. to be a "nation of secular laws."
The alternative, they said, would be a nation of religious laws.
"She's talking about a theocracy," said Sherwin. "And that's exactly opposite of what this country is based on." A clause in the First Amendment prohibits the establishment of a state religion.
Ahmed Bedier, the Central Florida director of the Council on American Islamic Relations, said he was "appalled that a person who's been in politics this long would hold such extreme views."
Bedier said most Christians would find such comments "shameful."
Harris has always professed a deep Christian faith and long been popular with Christian conservative voters.
In the Senate primary race, she has heavily courted that voting bloc, counting on them to put her into the general election against Democratic Sen. Bill Nelson.
But publicly, she rarely expresses such a fervent evangelical perspective.
University of Virginia political analyst Larry Sabato said the comments will appeal to Christian fundamentalists who typically turn out for Republican primaries.
But he said the strong evangelical tone could alienate non-Christians and more moderate Republicans who had been thinking of supporting Harris.
"It's insane," he said. "But it's not out of character for Katherine Harris."
Harris, a Republican from Longboat Key, is running against Orlando attorney Will McBride, retired Adm. LeRoy Collins and developer Peter Monroe in the GOP Senate primary.
McBride and Collins also did interviews with Florida Baptist Witness. Both said faith is an important part of their lives, but Harris' responses most directly tie her role as a policymaker to her religious beliefs.
Brooks, the Tampa area GOP activist, said such religious "arrogance" only damages the party.
"This notion that you've been chosen or anointed, it's offensive," said Brooks. "We hurt our cause with that more than we help it."
And if "God is the one who chooses our rulers," then what does it matter who we vote for? (Besides, Katherine Harris was the one who chose our ruler in 2000. Make of that what you will.)
Religious nuts are so confusing.
I've bolded my favorite quote below:
Harris' comments draw fierce reaction
Political and religious officials criticize the candidate's comments on electing Christians.
Jim Stratton
Sentinel Staff Writer
August 26, 2006
U.S. Rep. Katherine Harris said this week that God did not intend for the United States to be a "nation of secular laws" and that a failure to elect Christians to political office will allow lawmaking bodies to "legislate sin."
The remarks, published in the weekly journal of the Florida Baptist State Convention, unleashed a torrent of criticism from political and religious officials.
U.S. Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D-Weston, said she was "disgusted" by the comments "and deeply disappointed in Rep. Harris personally."
Harris, Wasserman Schultz said, "clearly shows that she does not deserve to be a representative. . . ."
State Rep. Irv Slosberg, D-Boca Raton, demanded an apology, saying the statements were "outrageous, even by her standards."
"What is going through this woman's mind?" said Slosberg who, like Wasserman Schultz, is Jewish. "We do not live in a theocracy."
The criticism was not limited to Democrats.
Ruby Brooks, a veteran Tampa Bay Republican activist, said Harris' remarks "were offensive to me as a Christian and a Republican."
"To me, it's the height of hubris," said Brooks, a former Largo Republican Club president and former member of the Pinellas County Republican Executive Committee.
And Jillian Hasner, executive director of the Republican Jewish Coalition, said: "I don't think it's representative of the Republican Party at all. Our party is much bigger and better than Katherine Harris is trying to make it."
The fallout follows an interview published in the Florida Baptist Witness, the weekly journal of the Florida Baptist State Convention. Witness editors interviewed candidates for office asking them to describe their faith and positions on certain issues.
Harris said her religious beliefs "animate" everything she does, including her votes in Congress.
She then warned voters that if they do not send Christians to office, they risk creating a government that is doomed to fail.
"If you are not electing Christians, tried and true, under public scrutiny and pressure, if you're not electing Christians, then in essence you are going to legislate sin," she told interviewers, citing abortion and gay marriage as two examples of that sin.
"Whenever we legislate sin," she said, "and we say abortion is permissible and we say gay unions are permissible, then average citizens who are not Christians, because they don't know better, we are leading them astray and it's wrong. . . ."
Harris also said the separation of church and state is a "lie we have been told" to keep religious people out of politics.
In reality, she said, "we have to have the faithful in government" because that is God's will. Separating religion and politics is "so wrong because God is the one who chooses our rulers," she said.
"And if we are the ones not actively involved in electing those godly men and women," then "we're going to have a nation of secular laws. That's not what our founding fathers intended and that's [sic] certainly isn't what God intended."
Harris campaign spokesman Jennifer Marks would not say what alternative to "a nation of secular laws" Harris would support. She would not answer questions about the Harris interview and, instead, released a two-sentence statement.
"Congresswoman Harris encourages Americans from all walks of life and faith to participate in our government," it stated. "She continues to be an unwavering advocate of religious rights and freedoms."
The notion that non-Christians "don't know better" or are less suited to govern disturbed Rabbi Rick Sherwin, president of the Greater Orlando Board of Rabbis.
"Anybody who claims to have a monopoly on God," he said, "doesn't understand the strength of America."
Sherwin and others also said Harris appeared to be voicing support for a religious state when she said God and the founding fathers did not intend the U.S. to be a "nation of secular laws."
The alternative, they said, would be a nation of religious laws.
"She's talking about a theocracy," said Sherwin. "And that's exactly opposite of what this country is based on." A clause in the First Amendment prohibits the establishment of a state religion.
Ahmed Bedier, the Central Florida director of the Council on American Islamic Relations, said he was "appalled that a person who's been in politics this long would hold such extreme views."
Bedier said most Christians would find such comments "shameful."
Harris has always professed a deep Christian faith and long been popular with Christian conservative voters.
In the Senate primary race, she has heavily courted that voting bloc, counting on them to put her into the general election against Democratic Sen. Bill Nelson.
But publicly, she rarely expresses such a fervent evangelical perspective.
University of Virginia political analyst Larry Sabato said the comments will appeal to Christian fundamentalists who typically turn out for Republican primaries.
But he said the strong evangelical tone could alienate non-Christians and more moderate Republicans who had been thinking of supporting Harris.
"It's insane," he said. "But it's not out of character for Katherine Harris."
Harris, a Republican from Longboat Key, is running against Orlando attorney Will McBride, retired Adm. LeRoy Collins and developer Peter Monroe in the GOP Senate primary.
McBride and Collins also did interviews with Florida Baptist Witness. Both said faith is an important part of their lives, but Harris' responses most directly tie her role as a policymaker to her religious beliefs.
Brooks, the Tampa area GOP activist, said such religious "arrogance" only damages the party.
"This notion that you've been chosen or anointed, it's offensive," said Brooks. "We hurt our cause with that more than we help it."
RQOTW: "I'll make sure that our future is defined not by the letters ACLU, but by the letters USA." -- Mitt Romney
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lukpac
- Top Dog and Sellout
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- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2003 11:51 pm
- Location: Madison, WI
- Contact:
Rspaight wrote:What if you elect Christians who are pro-choice and pro-gay marriage?
Those aren't really Christians.
"I know because it is impossible for a tape to hold the compression levels of these treble boosted MFSL's like Something/Anything. The metal particulate on the tape would shatter and all you'd hear is distortion if even that." - VD
-
lukpac
- Top Dog and Sellout
- Posts: 4591
- Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2003 11:51 pm
- Location: Madison, WI
- Contact:
Harris tries to douse furor over remarks to Baptists
Jim Stratton
Sentinel Staff Writer
August 27, 2006
U.S. Rep. Katherine Harris sought Saturday to smother a campaign brushfire stoked by an earlier claim that failure to elect Christians to public office would allow lawmakers to "legislate sin."
Harris, appearing at a gun show in Orlando, said she did not mean to offend non-Christians in her comments to the Florida Baptist Witness last week. She explained that she referred exclusively -- and repeatedly -- to Christians because she was being interviewed by the weekly journal of the Florida Baptist State Convention.
"My comments were specifically directed toward a Christian group," said Harris, a Republican Senate candidate from Longboat Key.
To reinforce that message, Harris' campaign also released a statement Saturday. It described her strong support of Israel and said when Harris called the separation of church and state a "lie" she was addressing "a common misperception that people of faith should not be actively involved in government."
"My rallying cry," she said, "has always been people of all faiths should be involved."
Harris ignited a furor with her Witness interview. She sounded a fervent evangelical tone, saying that God "chooses our rulers," that voters needed to send Christians to political office and that God did not intend for the United States to be a "nation of secular laws."
Speaking to Witness editors, Harris said:
"If you are not electing Christians, tried and true, under public scrutiny and pressure, if you're not electing Christians, then in essence you are going to legislate sin."
"If we are the ones not actively involved in electing those godly men and women," then "we're going to have a nation of secular laws. That's not what our founding fathers intended and that's [sic] certainly isn't what God intended."
On Friday, Jews, Muslims, Christians, Democrats and Republicans blasted the comments, saying Harris was suggesting non-Christians were less suited to govern or should be excluded altogether.
U.S. Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D-Weston, said she was "disgusted" by the remarks and "deeply disappointed in Rep. Harris personally."
And Jillian Hasner, executive director of the Florida chapter of the Republican Jewish Coalition, said Harris' statements were not "representative of the Republican Party at all."
Saturday, two of Harris' primary opponents joined the chorus of critical voices. Orlando lawyer Will McBride said Harris, deliberately or not, excluded people.
"I'm a Christian, and I'm a Republican and I don't share her views," said McBride, a lay minister and son of a pastor. "There are people of other faiths and backgrounds of outstanding integrity who know how to tell the truth."
Recently, McBride said Harris "has problems with the truth."
Another Harris opponent, developer Peter Monroe, called on Harris to drop out of the Senate race and resign from Congress. He said her comments were "warped, twisted and disgraceful."
Monroe took particular aim at this Harris comment from the Witness interview: "Whenever we legislate sin, and say abortion is permissible and we say gay unions are permissible, then average citizens who are not Christians, because they don't know better, we are leading them astray and it's wrong. . . ."
Monroe said Harris' statement that non-Christians "don't know better" were "contemptible, arrogant and wicked. . . ."
Harris, said Monroe, "is no longer fit to serve."
Monroe, McBride, Harris and LeRoy Collins are seeking the Republican nomination to take on Democratic Sen. Bill Nelson in the November general election.
Saturday, Harris did not apologize but said "it breaks my heart" if people were upset with her interview. She said "it wasn't my intent" to "section out Christians."
Though Harris directly addressed her remarks about church and state, she was less clear explaining her comments about God not intending for the U.S. to be "a nation of secular laws."
Asked whether the U.S. should be a secular country, Harris said: "I think that our laws, I mean, I look at how the law originated, even from Moses, the 10 Commandments. And I don't believe, that uh . . . That's how all of our laws originated in the United States, period. I think that's the basis of our rule of law."
Harris' clarification seemed to satisfy Pasco County Republican Party Chairman Bill Bunting. Bunting, Saturday's gun-show organizer, served as Harris' host for the day.
Before she arrived at the gun show, Bunting said he was concerned about her comments because Republicans "need to be inclusive of everyone."
But after talking with Harris for a few moments, Bunting said all was right.
"She cleared it up," he said. "I'm comfortable now."
Harris found a receptive crowd Saturday as she made her way from vendor to vendor, a small group of reporters trailing behind. Though her campaign has struggled to gain momentum, she remains popular among a core group of Republican voters, including gun owners.
Jo Jordan, an alligator trapper from Titusville, was typical.
"I like that she's here and that she's pro-gun," said Jordan, who had his picture taken with Harris and got an autographed T-shirt. "I'm supporting her."
Jim Stratton can be reached at jstratton@orlandosentinel.com or 407-420-5379.
Copyright © 2006, Orlando Sentinel
Jim Stratton
Sentinel Staff Writer
August 27, 2006
U.S. Rep. Katherine Harris sought Saturday to smother a campaign brushfire stoked by an earlier claim that failure to elect Christians to public office would allow lawmakers to "legislate sin."
Harris, appearing at a gun show in Orlando, said she did not mean to offend non-Christians in her comments to the Florida Baptist Witness last week. She explained that she referred exclusively -- and repeatedly -- to Christians because she was being interviewed by the weekly journal of the Florida Baptist State Convention.
"My comments were specifically directed toward a Christian group," said Harris, a Republican Senate candidate from Longboat Key.
To reinforce that message, Harris' campaign also released a statement Saturday. It described her strong support of Israel and said when Harris called the separation of church and state a "lie" she was addressing "a common misperception that people of faith should not be actively involved in government."
"My rallying cry," she said, "has always been people of all faiths should be involved."
Harris ignited a furor with her Witness interview. She sounded a fervent evangelical tone, saying that God "chooses our rulers," that voters needed to send Christians to political office and that God did not intend for the United States to be a "nation of secular laws."
Speaking to Witness editors, Harris said:
"If you are not electing Christians, tried and true, under public scrutiny and pressure, if you're not electing Christians, then in essence you are going to legislate sin."
"If we are the ones not actively involved in electing those godly men and women," then "we're going to have a nation of secular laws. That's not what our founding fathers intended and that's [sic] certainly isn't what God intended."
On Friday, Jews, Muslims, Christians, Democrats and Republicans blasted the comments, saying Harris was suggesting non-Christians were less suited to govern or should be excluded altogether.
U.S. Rep. Debbie Wasserman Schultz, D-Weston, said she was "disgusted" by the remarks and "deeply disappointed in Rep. Harris personally."
And Jillian Hasner, executive director of the Florida chapter of the Republican Jewish Coalition, said Harris' statements were not "representative of the Republican Party at all."
Saturday, two of Harris' primary opponents joined the chorus of critical voices. Orlando lawyer Will McBride said Harris, deliberately or not, excluded people.
"I'm a Christian, and I'm a Republican and I don't share her views," said McBride, a lay minister and son of a pastor. "There are people of other faiths and backgrounds of outstanding integrity who know how to tell the truth."
Recently, McBride said Harris "has problems with the truth."
Another Harris opponent, developer Peter Monroe, called on Harris to drop out of the Senate race and resign from Congress. He said her comments were "warped, twisted and disgraceful."
Monroe took particular aim at this Harris comment from the Witness interview: "Whenever we legislate sin, and say abortion is permissible and we say gay unions are permissible, then average citizens who are not Christians, because they don't know better, we are leading them astray and it's wrong. . . ."
Monroe said Harris' statement that non-Christians "don't know better" were "contemptible, arrogant and wicked. . . ."
Harris, said Monroe, "is no longer fit to serve."
Monroe, McBride, Harris and LeRoy Collins are seeking the Republican nomination to take on Democratic Sen. Bill Nelson in the November general election.
Saturday, Harris did not apologize but said "it breaks my heart" if people were upset with her interview. She said "it wasn't my intent" to "section out Christians."
Though Harris directly addressed her remarks about church and state, she was less clear explaining her comments about God not intending for the U.S. to be "a nation of secular laws."
Asked whether the U.S. should be a secular country, Harris said: "I think that our laws, I mean, I look at how the law originated, even from Moses, the 10 Commandments. And I don't believe, that uh . . . That's how all of our laws originated in the United States, period. I think that's the basis of our rule of law."
Harris' clarification seemed to satisfy Pasco County Republican Party Chairman Bill Bunting. Bunting, Saturday's gun-show organizer, served as Harris' host for the day.
Before she arrived at the gun show, Bunting said he was concerned about her comments because Republicans "need to be inclusive of everyone."
But after talking with Harris for a few moments, Bunting said all was right.
"She cleared it up," he said. "I'm comfortable now."
Harris found a receptive crowd Saturday as she made her way from vendor to vendor, a small group of reporters trailing behind. Though her campaign has struggled to gain momentum, she remains popular among a core group of Republican voters, including gun owners.
Jo Jordan, an alligator trapper from Titusville, was typical.
"I like that she's here and that she's pro-gun," said Jordan, who had his picture taken with Harris and got an autographed T-shirt. "I'm supporting her."
Jim Stratton can be reached at jstratton@orlandosentinel.com or 407-420-5379.
Copyright © 2006, Orlando Sentinel
"I know because it is impossible for a tape to hold the compression levels of these treble boosted MFSL's like Something/Anything. The metal particulate on the tape would shatter and all you'd hear is distortion if even that." - VD
-
Rspaight
- Posts: 4386
- Joined: Wed Apr 30, 2003 10:48 am
- Location: The Reality-Based Community
- Contact:
Asked whether the U.S. should be a secular country, Harris said: "I think that our laws, I mean, I look at how the law originated, even from Moses, the 10 Commandments. And I don't believe, that uh . . . That's how all of our laws originated in the United States, period. I think that's the basis of our rule of law."
Anyone uttering that series of words should be automatically disqualified from holding any public office, down to and including dog catcher.
Ryan
RQOTW: "I'll make sure that our future is defined not by the letters ACLU, but by the letters USA." -- Mitt Romney
If you're gonna be a nutjob, at least have the balls (or the female equivalent thereof) to stand by your nutjob rants.
"When people speak to you about a preventive war, you tell them to go and fight it. After my experience, I have come to hate war." – Dwight D. Eisenhower
"Neither slave nor tyrant." - Basque motto
"Neither slave nor tyrant." - Basque motto
