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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 4:56 am 
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A guy in the UK has a few mono albums that have never been on CD. He is doing needle drops, and I did one trade so far with him.

The thing is, his turntable is too fast. According to his own words, the speed is 2.9% too fast. He also says that he doesn't know how adjust the speed on the turntable.

What would be the easiest way to correct it? If the .wav files (standard redbook resolution) are manipulated in an audio program like Adobe Audition, would the pitch/speed correction cause any audible loss? Should he "rip" the LP to a higher resolution first?

I am sorry for these extremely basic questions, but since I haven't done a needle drop ever in my life, I really don't know. Thanks in advance.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 8:44 am 
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Andreas wrote:
What would be the easiest way to correct it?


Have him get a turntable that runs at the right speed...

Quote:
If the .wav files (standard redbook resolution) are manipulated in an audio program like Adobe Audition, would the pitch/speed correction cause any audible loss? Should he "rip" the LP to a higher resolution first?


I don't have experience with Audition, but I've noticed issues with a few ProTools plug-ins. The one that comes with PT Free seems to cut the high end a bit, while another one I've tried messes up transients. YMMV.

I'm guessing a higher sampling rate could probably help - not so sure about higher bit depth.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 8:55 am 
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lukpac wrote:
Have him get a turntable that runs at the right speed...

That's not an option...


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 10:04 am 
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I don't know if this is even possible, or whether this wild-ass guess is at all right in the first place, but maybe if he tried sampling the audio at 45378.9 Hz, and then adjusting the samplerate to 44.1 kHz, that'd get him at least somewhere in the ballpark?

Just a crazy idea


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 10:37 am 
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damianm wrote:
I don't know if this is even possible, or whether this wild-ass guess is at all right in the first place, but maybe if he tried sampling the audio at 45378.9 Hz, and then adjusting the samplerate to 44.1 kHz, that'd get him at least somewhere in the ballpark?

Just a crazy idea


You know, if the soundcard had the option, that would actually probably be the best way. No resampling necessary. I know with my system, though, I can only select 44/48/88/96.

Damn...that would be perfect for LALC.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 11:40 am 
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Andreas wrote:
A guy in the UK has a few mono albums that have never been on CD. He is doing needle drops, and I did one trade so far with him.

The thing is, his turntable is too fast. According to his own words, the speed is 2.9% too fast. He also says that he doesn't know how adjust the speed on the turntable.

What would be the easiest way to correct it? If the .wav files (standard redbook resolution) are manipulated in an audio program like Adobe Audition, would the pitch/speed correction cause any audible loss? Should he "rip" the LP to a higher resolution first?

I am sorry for these extremely basic questions, but since I haven't done a needle drop ever in my life, I really don't know. Thanks in advance.



Pitch correction is the way to go. You can either capture the LP at 32 or upconvert it from 16 to 32 to perform the pitch correction. No audible loss should be apparent if you perform the operation in the 32-bit realm, then quantize back down to 16 bit when you're done. Audition can do all this for you. It has tool specifically for pitch adjustment. Nominal 44.1 kHz sample rate should be fine throughout.

If you're queasy about any of this, send me a copy and I'll do it for you.

(An operation that *does* tend to produce artifacts IMO is adjusting the speed *without* changing pitch. But luckily that's not what you want to do.)

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 5:26 pm 
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lukpac wrote:
damianm wrote:
..sampling the audio at 45378.9 Hz, and then adjusting the samplerate to 44.1 kHz ..


You know, if the soundcard had the option, that would actually probably be the best way. No resampling necessary. I know with my system, though, I can only select 44/48/88/96.

Damn...that would be perfect for LALC.

Luke, I was wondering .. maybe something like Total Recorder (I've never used it, so I'm just guessing here) or some other similar piece of software that uses a 'virtual' soundcard -sort of- as its input, would let you record at SRs other than 44/48/88/96?

Just a thought


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 30, 2006 5:37 pm 
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No idea...all my audio stuff is done on the Mac.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 12:57 am 
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krabapple wrote:
Pitch correction is the way to go. You can either capture the LP at 32 or upconvert it from 16 to 32 to perform the pitch correction. No audible loss should be apparent if you perform the operation in the 32-bit realm, then quantize back down to 16 bit when you're done. Audition can do all this for you. It has tool specifically for pitch adjustment. Nominal 44.1 kHz sample rate should be fine throughout.


Thanks a lot. I will give him that info.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 4:36 am 
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krabapple,

here is what he replied after I sent him your info:

Quote:
Ok. So I convert to 32bit, perform pitch correction and then convert back to 16bit. I assume I'll need to dither the file when downsampling? Do you know how this is done on Audition?
I'll try to get this done tonight and mail it out as soon as possible.

Any ideas?


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2006 1:43 pm 
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1. open the main file (in 16/44 is OK) and copy a short piece of it to another file. Close the main file.
2. go to Effects-->Time/Pitch --> Stretch
3. select Resample (preserves neither pitch nor tempo) , set the slidebar to 100 (unchanged) then choose a value from 'transpose' (1 sharp, 2 sharp, etc -- each one is a semitone) that makes your sample sound right when you listen using 'preview'. Hopefully you have some reference you can compare it to -- a CD version, a tuning fork, a pitchpipe, whatever -- to get the pitch right. When you pick a 'transpose' value' the slidebar will move, reflecting the amount of 'strech' or 'compress' that will take place.
4. you can tinker with the 'ratio' and length' values to fine-tune the pitch
5. when you are satisfied with the settting, save it as a preset
6. Close your sample file, then open your main file as a 32-bit file (you can do this either by first setting Options-->Setting--Data --> Auto-convert all data to 32-bit upon opening, or by opening the file and using Edit-->Convert Sample Type to reset file resolution to 32 bit.
7. go to Effects-->Time/Pitch-->Stretch and apply the Stretch preset you saved , to the whole file. (it should be set to 'High precision' by default; if not, select that)
8. when it's done, go to Edit-->Convert Sample Type, set sample rate at 44100, set resolution at 16-bit. The Dither box will activate, leave the default settings at 'Enable', '1' , 'triangular' and 'no noise shaping' . Hit OK and when it's done, you're done. Save the file (or split it into tracks and save them).

If you are going to do any other processing -- click fixing, EQ, normalizing -- do it while you're in the 32-bit domain. It's OK to split the tracks and other simple editing in the 16-bit domain.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 1:39 am 
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Krabapple,

thanks for all the help. It seems it worked.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 12:41 pm 
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Which mono albums are we talking about?

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2006 1:11 pm 
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Shut Down Volume 2, All Summer Long.


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